Aug. 19, 2024
Establishing and Proving the Value of Public Relations
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This episode dives into the ongoing challenge of establishing and proving the value of public relations work to clients.
That Solo Life Episode 262: Establishing and Proving the Value of Public Relations
In this EpisodeIn this episode of "That Solo Life," co-hosts Karen Swim, APR and Michelle Kane discuss the ongoing challenge of establishing and proving the value of public relations work to clients. Independent PR professionals must navigate the complexities of demonstrating the impact of their efforts in a landscape where marketing, advertising, and PR often get lumped together.
The hosts discuss the importance of metrics and measuring the success of PR campaigns, especially in times of economic uncertainty where clients may be more focused on immediate revenue generation. They emphasize the distinction between PR and marketing, highlighting the nuanced ways in which PR professionals contribute to a company's bottom line.
Throughout the episode, Karen and Michelle share personal experiences and insights on how to effectively communicate the value of PR to clients. They stress the need for open and candid conversations about goals, success metrics, and the evolving needs of the client's business. The hosts acknowledge the challenges of navigating client expectations and the pressure to deliver tangible results in a competitive market.
As the conversation unfolds, the hosts encourage PR professionals to hone their measurement skills, delve into data analytics, and craft compelling narratives that showcase the impact of PR efforts on business outcomes. They underscore the importance of continuous learning, adaptation, and proactive communication to build trust and credibility with clients.
In conclusion, Karen and Michelle urge listeners to stay resilient, proactive, and focused on delivering value in a rapidly changing industry. They invite feedback and shared experiences from the audience, emphasizing the collective learning and growth within the PR community. The episode serves as a reminder of the ongoing journey to elevate the role of PR professionals and demonstrate their indispensable contribution to business success.
Episode Timeline
- 00:02:02 - Establishing and Proving the Value of PR
- 00:05:16 - Focus on PR and Marketing Value
- 00:07:01 - Conversations about Goals and Success
- 00:09:35 - Adapting to Client Needs and Market Changes
- 00:10:51 - Navigating Sales-Driven Organizations
- 00:12:41 - Understanding Client Perspectives and Decision Making
- 00:13:33 - Importance of Measurement and Metrics
- 00:14:30 - Conclusion and Call for Better Storytelling
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That Solo Life Episode 262: Establishing and Proving the Value of Public Relations
Michelle Kane [00:18]-[00:33]: Thank you for joining us for this episode of That Solo Life, the podcast for PR pros and marketers who work for themselves. People like me, Michelle Kane with Voice Matters, and my EverSteady co-host, Karen Swim with Solo PR Pro. Hi, Karen. How are you today?
Karen Swim, APR [00:33]-[00:37]: Hi, Michelle. I'm doing really good today. How are you?
Michelle Kane [00:37]-[01:00]: I'm doing well, doing well. Yeah, I can't believe we are chugging through August already. It's hard to believe. We're in a little bit of a post-Olympic haze, which is fine. When this hits, the Paralympics will be happening, which is pretty awesome. But yeah, just trying to milk the last few bits of fun out of summer.
Karen Swim, APR [01:00]-[01:05]: I'm ready for fall. It's true.
Michelle Kane [01:06]-[01:14]: I hate to see the daylight go, but yeah, I'm definitely ready for some cooler temperatures and things like that. Yeah, me too. Yeah, bring it on.
Karen Swim, APR [01:14]-[01:30]: Bring on the easy, breezy days. Bring on sweaters and hoodies and football and cinnamon and crunchy leaves. I'm just ready. Summer has been, eh. It's been a lot. It's been a lot.
Michelle Kane [01:30]-[02:34]: The summer has definitely been a lot. But speaking of things that are a lot. And we have talked about this a lot in a lot of different ways, but we just find ourselves coming up against this again and again, and that is establishing and proving the value of the work of public relations with clients, you know, just really establishing its worth that the work we do Well, yes, we can tie it back to certain metrics. It just seems like sometimes we keep saying this, and I don't know, is it me? We keep expressing the value, and yet sometimes you're met with blank stares or, well, no, we didn't sell six widgets. It's like… That's not how it works all the time. So we thought we'd just chat about this and try and rev ourselves up and you, our listeners, up and help us all get inspired about really how to best convey our value.
Karen Swim, APR [02:34]-[03:26]: I think we have many times on this program talked about the value of metrics and why we all need to get better about measuring our work. But I think particularly this year, when the economy has been so uncertain, people have felt like they wanted to hold on to budgets. There were cuts that were made coming into the year, and then there just hasn't been spending. And there's no secret that in our industry, there's not been a lot of leads, in general. This does not apply to absolutely everyone. But, you know, there hasn't been a lot of leads because people have not wanted to make an additional spend that the conversations more and more continue to turn to. giving public relations a line directly to revenue.
Michelle Kane [03:26]-[04:32]: Yeah. Yeah. When it's really not, it's not really what it's meant to do. And, you know, as we've discussed, we get lumped under marketing or, you know, a lot of times you're, you're just dealing with people who are throwing around all these terms, marketing, advertising, PR, like they're all interchangeable. What they're really talking about is the larger concept of promotion, under which there are many specific elements that we could drill down all day on. You've got your digital marketing this, you've got your broadcast here, your streaming there, your pay-per-click. And it's a lot. And we're but a part of it, but we're an important part of it. Oftentimes we're laying the groundwork. Oftentimes we're the ones introducing your concept, your product, your initiative. We're leading the way on helping your public know what you are, why you're important. And honestly, the rest of it should work around us to further establish that fact and get people in the door.
Karen Swim, APR [04:33]-[06:15]: Well, here's another bold statement that I will make for our colleagues in marketing. We are well aware that marketing is also not the sales department. And it's difficult because in these types of environments, and I've seen this in my entire career, when money becomes a focus, meaning that there is a worry about money, Either you're worried that you're not going to be able to get funding, or you're worried that people are not spending their money. When everything's become really tight, there becomes a heightened focus on perceived value of marketing and PR. So those are the departments that often get chopped, because they, you know, no one can understand what role they play in actually generating revenue. And I am not one of those people that is saying that PR cannot be measured, and that PR cannot show the metrics that show the value to the bottom line of the organization. But what I am saying is that PR and marketing are not the same discipline, and that it's a little more complex and a little more nuanced in how we deliver value that adds to the bottom line of a corporation. And when we continue to have to explain that over and over again, sometimes it can feel so disheartening. You know, there are days that I feel like, My God, I just want out of this industry, because people don't get it. And I wonder if we're ever going to go back to where we really understand the value of PR professionals. Now, those are my moments. I get past them. But I have them too.
Michelle Kane [06:15]-[07:00]: Yeah, yeah, no, I agree. And I think sometimes, too, it makes you think, well, I don't know, I'm saying these words. Am I wrong? Do I not know what I'm doing anymore? You know, these people that pretend to know better than me, when I know deep, deep down, they don't. Not to come from a point of defensiveness, but it is sometimes a bit galling when, not that I would also ever condone questioning a client's professionality at what they do, but it's like, hey, I don't try to do your job. Don't try to do mine. We've spent a fair amount of money learning our disciplines, so we kind of know what we're doing, and you really need to trust us that we have your best interest at heart.
Karen Swim, APR [07:01]-[08:32]: I think it goes back to having those very open, candid conversations about goals. What is it? Bottom line, what does success look like for you? Forget the terms. Forget the language around it. It's really dissecting what your client wants to achieve. And then saying, here is how I can contribute to that success. You can't always be responsible. So I always, you know, and not just me, but we as PR professionals, we always educate clients that we cannot control the sales funnel. Because we can't. We don't have accountability for everything that happens in the funnel. We're not nurturing those leads. We can help to drive top-of-funnel leads. But we're not responsible for the end process. And so there are so many things that have to happen. If we are, for example, sending people to your website, are you able to capture those leads? Are you, do you have a dedicated process in order to nurture those leads? I mean, there are just so many things that we don't do. That's not our job. And I, however, I'm going to hold us responsible for continuously having those conversations with clients, because We can't just sit here and say we do have value if we're not willing to have those deeper conversations to show that value to the client very clearly in their language, very black and white, and very blunt terms.
Michelle Kane [08:33]-[09:34]: Yeah, and it's just perfect what you said. And I think, especially in these times, like you said, you know, people aren't corporations, companies, clients, they're holding on to their spending right now. I mean, look, we're in an election year. That's not unusual, right? People want to say, all right, well, we want to see what 2025 is going to look like. And then we'll make some big moves. So many of us are going to be in a bit of a holding pattern these next few months. So it may be necessary to have that conversation of, all right, checking in. I know we established what success looks like for you six months ago. But time has passed. Is that still what we're looking at? Have things changed within the company? I know that's happened as well in many cases, you know, things have changed. They might be deciding to look in a different direction for some of their promotions or initiatives. It's just important to make sure that we're, you know, taking stock and staying on the pulse of that.
Karen Swim, APR [09:35]-[11:08]: I, I agree. And I think, you know, for PR professionals, I would, I want to encourage you, always make sure that you're doing your business development and that you are listening to those cues that you're hearing from clients and taking that in and learning from them. Because you may need to pivot in ways in the short term so that you can have a more direct line that makes sense to them. Because, and sometimes, I will be 100% honest, and I think that we have to see those signs and act on them immediately. There are going to be those organizations that are simply going to be sales-driven, and they're going to cut you at the first opportunity. Because they are focused on growth, and that's it. And if you're not driving growth, then you're out. I've seen it. I've been a victim of it. Listen when they tell you, because it comes across, it can come across in subtle ways initially, but you don't want to wait until you're being pushed out of the door. In some cases, you may be the one that needs to make that recommendation, like, hey, we'll finish out the quarter. We'll finish out the year. Here are the things that we're going to focus on. But it sounds like what would be best for this term is for you to focus on selves, and maybe we'll check back in 6 months and see, you know, where things are. That's just the reality. And that's painful. And it's painful for me to even say those words, because I want more for all of us, but we are just in a crazy time right now.
Michelle Kane [11:09]-[11:28]: Yeah, yeah. That's not to say that it's, you know, it's not bad, it's just strange. You know, the economy is still decent, it's just, we're all in this situation of, okay, what's happening? All right, well, we'll just, you know, just keep treading water, which is really, what else can you do?
Karen Swim, APR [11:29]-[12:30]: I feel like we're all doing that. And I mean, we have to not take these things personally. But again, I do think that we should be learning from what we're hearing, that we should really be paying attention. A lot of times PR people talk about PR, but we don't talk about the broader economy and the broader markets that we actually serve and what really matters to them. And I'm telling you that Organizations care about making money. That hasn't changed ever. That's not new. That's not new. That's always been the case. But when there is a freer flow of money, should I say, And people are not worried, so worried about the economic future. They're able to relax and understand the nuances of how things fit together and how it all drives to that goal. Right now, some people just aren't seeing it. In the same way that we're making decisions in our own personal spending, right? You know, we're saying, I don't need to watch TV.
Karem Swim, APR [12:32]-[12:41]: Yeah, that cheese that I love, I don't love it at that price. So I'm just going to go without cheese.
Michelle Kane [12:41]-[13:33]: Or I'm going to get my cheese elsewhere. Yeah, it's true. But I think always being and it's always a good idea. Let's say as you present results, as you share updates of what you're doing, to always speak to those points that your client will appreciate. It doesn't have to be a major thing because we're good at crafting messaging. Just those little subtle ways will build up by showing that, yeah, I get you. And here is how what we're doing is going to impact that. It may not work in every instance. You know, there's always going to be somebody who is just solely focused on the bottom line and in spite of themselves will make a decision. And that's, you know what, that's on them. That's not on you one bit.
Karen Swim, APR [13:33]-[14:27]: Yeah, I agree. But I do think we all should double down on our measurement muscles. And if you're uncomfortable in that space or you feel like, you know, I'm not sure there's so many good resources out there to learn, learn. Study your own metrics. Look at the things that tie back. You know, really start to dig in and present it often, because that is what executives are paying attention to. So you can't afford to just, you know, rely on the good graces and things are going well, and here's our media coverage. What does that media coverage really mean? We've got to tell a better story. That's on us and our industry. And I have faith in us. I know that we can do it. I especially know that PR pros are quite adept at making a case, a business case. We just need to do an even better job of it. So if you're great at it, be greater.
Michelle Kane [14:30]-[15:15]: That's all, that's all we have. No, it's true. And I think many of us are conscientious enough that we know better than to just rely on someone's good graces because we know, you know, they're going to want concrete information. Well, we hope you found value in this time together today. I know it helped us get that off our chest. But if you have some comments or some feedback or, hey, we would love to hear from you of, hey, this happened to me and this is how I handled it. My goodness. We would love to share that with the rest of our listeners. So please let us know at soloprpro.com. And if you did find value in our time together today, please share it around. And until next time, thanks for listening to That Solo Life.
Michelle Kane [00:18]-[00:33]: Thank you for joining us for this episode of That Solo Life, the podcast for PR pros and marketers who work for themselves. People like me, Michelle Kane with Voice Matters, and my EverSteady co-host, Karen Swim with Solo PR Pro. Hi, Karen. How are you today?
Karen Swim, APR [00:33]-[00:37]: Hi, Michelle. I'm doing really good today. How are you?
Michelle Kane [00:37]-[01:00]: I'm doing well, doing well. Yeah, I can't believe we are chugging through August already. It's hard to believe. We're in a little bit of a post-Olympic haze, which is fine. When this hits, the Paralympics will be happening, which is pretty awesome. But yeah, just trying to milk the last few bits of fun out of summer.
Karen Swim, APR [01:00]-[01:05]: I'm ready for fall. It's true.
Michelle Kane [01:06]-[01:14]: I hate to see the daylight go, but yeah, I'm definitely ready for some cooler temperatures and things like that. Yeah, me too. Yeah, bring it on.
Karen Swim, APR [01:14]-[01:30]: Bring on the easy, breezy days. Bring on sweaters and hoodies and football and cinnamon and crunchy leaves. I'm just ready. Summer has been, eh. It's been a lot. It's been a lot.
Michelle Kane [01:30]-[02:34]: The summer has definitely been a lot. But speaking of things that are a lot. And we have talked about this a lot in a lot of different ways, but we just find ourselves coming up against this again and again, and that is establishing and proving the value of the work of public relations with clients, you know, just really establishing its worth that the work we do Well, yes, we can tie it back to certain metrics. It just seems like sometimes we keep saying this, and I don't know, is it me? We keep expressing the value, and yet sometimes you're met with blank stares or, well, no, we didn't sell six widgets. It's like… That's not how it works all the time. So we thought we'd just chat about this and try and rev ourselves up and you, our listeners, up and help us all get inspired about really how to best convey our value.
Karen Swim, APR [02:34]-[03:26]: I think we have many times on this program talked about the value of metrics and why we all need to get better about measuring our work. But I think particularly this year, when the economy has been so uncertain, people have felt like they wanted to hold on to budgets. There were cuts that were made coming into the year, and then there just hasn't been spending. And there's no secret that in our industry, there's not been a lot of leads, in general. This does not apply to absolutely everyone. But, you know, there hasn't been a lot of leads because people have not wanted to make an additional spend that the conversations more and more continue to turn to. giving public relations a line directly to revenue.
Michelle Kane [03:26]-[04:32]: Yeah. Yeah. When it's really not, it's not really what it's meant to do. And, you know, as we've discussed, we get lumped under marketing or, you know, a lot of times you're, you're just dealing with people who are throwing around all these terms, marketing, advertising, PR, like they're all interchangeable. What they're really talking about is the larger concept of promotion, under which there are many specific elements that we could drill down all day on. You've got your digital marketing this, you've got your broadcast here, your streaming there, your pay-per-click. And it's a lot. And we're but a part of it, but we're an important part of it. Oftentimes we're laying the groundwork. Oftentimes we're the ones introducing your concept, your product, your initiative. We're leading the way on helping your public know what you are, why you're important. And honestly, the rest of it should work around us to further establish that fact and get people in the door.
Karen Swim, APR [04:33]-[06:15]: Well, here's another bold statement that I will make for our colleagues in marketing. We are well aware that marketing is also not the sales department. And it's difficult because in these types of environments, and I've seen this in my entire career, when money becomes a focus, meaning that there is a worry about money, Either you're worried that you're not going to be able to get funding, or you're worried that people are not spending their money. When everything's become really tight, there becomes a heightened focus on perceived value of marketing and PR. So those are the departments that often get chopped, because they, you know, no one can understand what role they play in actually generating revenue. And I am not one of those people that is saying that PR cannot be measured, and that PR cannot show the metrics that show the value to the bottom line of the organization. But what I am saying is that PR and marketing are not the same discipline, and that it's a little more complex and a little more nuanced in how we deliver value that adds to the bottom line of a corporation. And when we continue to have to explain that over and over again, sometimes it can feel so disheartening. You know, there are days that I feel like, My God, I just want out of this industry, because people don't get it. And I wonder if we're ever going to go back to where we really understand the value of PR professionals. Now, those are my moments. I get past them. But I have them too.
Michelle Kane [06:15]-[07:00]: Yeah, yeah, no, I agree. And I think sometimes, too, it makes you think, well, I don't know, I'm saying these words. Am I wrong? Do I not know what I'm doing anymore? You know, these people that pretend to know better than me, when I know deep, deep down, they don't. Not to come from a point of defensiveness, but it is sometimes a bit galling when, not that I would also ever condone questioning a client's professionality at what they do, but it's like, hey, I don't try to do your job. Don't try to do mine. We've spent a fair amount of money learning our disciplines, so we kind of know what we're doing, and you really need to trust us that we have your best interest at heart.
Karen Swim, APR [07:01]-[08:32]: I think it goes back to having those very open, candid conversations about goals. What is it? Bottom line, what does success look like for you? Forget the terms. Forget the language around it. It's really dissecting what your client wants to achieve. And then saying, here is how I can contribute to that success. You can't always be responsible. So I always, you know, and not just me, but we as PR professionals, we always educate clients that we cannot control the sales funnel. Because we can't. We don't have accountability for everything that happens in the funnel. We're not nurturing those leads. We can help to drive top-of-funnel leads. But we're not responsible for the end process. And so there are so many things that have to happen. If we are, for example, sending people to your website, are you able to capture those leads? Are you, do you have a dedicated process in order to nurture those leads? I mean, there are just so many things that we don't do. That's not our job. And I, however, I'm going to hold us responsible for continuously having those conversations with clients, because We can't just sit here and say we do have value if we're not willing to have those deeper conversations to show that value to the client very clearly in their language, very black and white, and very blunt terms.
Michelle Kane [08:33]-[09:34]: Yeah, and it's just perfect what you said. And I think, especially in these times, like you said, you know, people aren't corporations, companies, clients, they're holding on to their spending right now. I mean, look, we're in an election year. That's not unusual, right? People want to say, all right, well, we want to see what 2025 is going to look like. And then we'll make some big moves. So many of us are going to be in a bit of a holding pattern these next few months. So it may be necessary to have that conversation of, all right, checking in. I know we established what success looks like for you six months ago. But time has passed. Is that still what we're looking at? Have things changed within the company? I know that's happened as well in many cases, you know, things have changed. They might be deciding to look in a different direction for some of their promotions or initiatives. It's just important to make sure that we're, you know, taking stock and staying on the pulse of that.
Karen Swim, APR [09:35]-[11:08]: I, I agree. And I think, you know, for PR professionals, I would, I want to encourage you, always make sure that you're doing your business development and that you are listening to those cues that you're hearing from clients and taking that in and learning from them. Because you may need to pivot in ways in the short term so that you can have a more direct line that makes sense to them. Because, and sometimes, I will be 100% honest, and I think that we have to see those signs and act on them immediately. There are going to be those organizations that are simply going to be sales-driven, and they're going to cut you at the first opportunity. Because they are focused on growth, and that's it. And if you're not driving growth, then you're out. I've seen it. I've been a victim of it. Listen when they tell you, because it comes across, it can come across in subtle ways initially, but you don't want to wait until you're being pushed out of the door. In some cases, you may be the one that needs to make that recommendation, like, hey, we'll finish out the quarter. We'll finish out the year. Here are the things that we're going to focus on. But it sounds like what would be best for this term is for you to focus on selves, and maybe we'll check back in 6 months and see, you know, where things are. That's just the reality. And that's painful. And it's painful for me to even say those words, because I want more for all of us, but we are just in a crazy time right now.
Michelle Kane [11:09]-[11:28]: Yeah, yeah. That's not to say that it's, you know, it's not bad, it's just strange. You know, the economy is still decent, it's just, we're all in this situation of, okay, what's happening? All right, well, we'll just, you know, just keep treading water, which is really, what else can you do?
Karen Swim, APR [11:29]-[12:30]: I feel like we're all doing that. And I mean, we have to not take these things personally. But again, I do think that we should be learning from what we're hearing, that we should really be paying attention. A lot of times PR people talk about PR, but we don't talk about the broader economy and the broader markets that we actually serve and what really matters to them. And I'm telling you that Organizations care about making money. That hasn't changed ever. That's not new. That's not new. That's always been the case. But when there is a freer flow of money, should I say, And people are not worried, so worried about the economic future. They're able to relax and understand the nuances of how things fit together and how it all drives to that goal. Right now, some people just aren't seeing it. In the same way that we're making decisions in our own personal spending, right? You know, we're saying, I don't need to watch TV.
Karem Swim, APR [12:32]-[12:41]: Yeah, that cheese that I love, I don't love it at that price. So I'm just going to go without cheese.
Michelle Kane [12:41]-[13:33]: Or I'm going to get my cheese elsewhere. Yeah, it's true. But I think always being and it's always a good idea. Let's say as you present results, as you share updates of what you're doing, to always speak to those points that your client will appreciate. It doesn't have to be a major thing because we're good at crafting messaging. Just those little subtle ways will build up by showing that, yeah, I get you. And here is how what we're doing is going to impact that. It may not work in every instance. You know, there's always going to be somebody who is just solely focused on the bottom line and in spite of themselves will make a decision. And that's, you know what, that's on them. That's not on you one bit.
Karen Swim, APR [13:33]-[14:27]: Yeah, I agree. But I do think we all should double down on our measurement muscles. And if you're uncomfortable in that space or you feel like, you know, I'm not sure there's so many good resources out there to learn, learn. Study your own metrics. Look at the things that tie back. You know, really start to dig in and present it often, because that is what executives are paying attention to. So you can't afford to just, you know, rely on the good graces and things are going well, and here's our media coverage. What does that media coverage really mean? We've got to tell a better story. That's on us and our industry. And I have faith in us. I know that we can do it. I especially know that PR pros are quite adept at making a case, a business case. We just need to do an even better job of it. So if you're great at it, be greater.
Michelle Kane [14:30]-[15:15]: That's all, that's all we have. No, it's true. And I think many of us are conscientious enough that we know better than to just rely on someone's good graces because we know, you know, they're going to want concrete information. Well, we hope you found value in this time together today. I know it helped us get that off our chest. But if you have some comments or some feedback or, hey, we would love to hear from you of, hey, this happened to me and this is how I handled it. My goodness. We would love to share that with the rest of our listeners. So please let us know at soloprpro.com. And if you did find value in our time together today, please share it around. And until next time, thanks for listening to That Solo Life.