Aug. 5, 2024
How To Break In or Out of Being a Solo PR Pro
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That Solo Life Episode 260: How To Break In or Out of Being a Solo PR Pro
In this Episode
Do you want to make the leap to being a Solo PR Pro? Or are you a Solo longing for the steady rhythm and challenge of an in-house job? In today’s episode of "That Solo Life," co-hosts Karen Swim, APR and Michelle Kane discuss diving in or out of being a Solo P Pro.
Life is not stagnant and that applies to your PR career. We all navigate different seasons of life and our career aspirations and capacity may evolve to fit that season. Decades ago, consulting or freelancing was seen as a temporary measure between jobs. Today, it is rightly recognized as a legitimate career path offering control and flexibility. This shift in the perception of solo work makes it easier to move in and out of working for yourself and working n-house.
In the episode, Karen and Michelle discuss the factors to consider when contemplating a shift between solo work and traditional employment. Michelle emphasizes the need for self-motivation, financial preparedness, and a clear understanding of market demand when venturing into solo work. Karen stresses the significance of intentional networking and skill development for those considering a return to in-house positions.
Throughout the episode, the hosts emphasize the importance of aligning work with personal fulfillment and the freedom to pursue different paths based on individual needs and desires. They encourage listeners to share their experiences and questions, inviting engagement and feedback for future episodes.
Listeners are encouraged to visit the soloprpro.com website to connect with the hosts and share their stories. The episode concludes with a call to action for sharing and reviewing the podcast to support its growth and reach.
The episode is a great reminder that public relations professionals can build a career customized to their needs and aspirations, adjusting it along the way to fit the fluidity of their lives.
Episode Timeline
- 00:00:00 - Introduction and Midsummer Stride: Michelle and Karen discuss the midsummer season and ignore the back-to-school rush.
- 00:05:30 - Evolving Attitudes Towards Consulting: Karen reflects on the evolution of consulting from a stopgap measure to a career choice.
- 00:09:27 - Flexibility in Career Choices: Michelle and Karen emphasize the importance of flexibility in transitioning between solo work and in-house positions.
- 00:12:33 - Networking Strategies: Karen provides insights on networking strategies for transitioning between solo work and in-house positions.
- 00:15:23 - Pursuing Fulfillment: Michelle and Karen discuss the balance between pursuing fulfilling work and jobs that provide stability and benefits.
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That Solo Life Episode 260: How to Break In or Out of Being a Solo PR Pro
Michelle Kane[00:00- 00:18].: Thank you for joining us for this episode of That Solo Life, the podcast for PR pros and marketers who work for themselves. People like me, Michelle Kane of Voice Matters, and my wonderful co-host, Karen Swim, APR of Solo PR Pro. Hi, Karen. Here we are again. How are you doing?
Karen Swim, APR [00:18.714]-[00:22.495]: Here we are. Hello, Michelle. I'm doing great. How are you?
Michelle Kane [00:22.495]-[00:32.759]: Good, good. I'm doing well, doing well. I guess it's safe to say as we're recording this, we're hitting our midsummer stride. I'm ignoring all the back to school things. It's ridiculous. Come on now. It's still hot and humid outside.
Karen Swim, APR [00:34.504]-[00:48.665]: That's true. You know what? A lot of people are going to college in a couple of weeks. And I guess maybe some of the schools start. That's so weird because it feels like we shouldn't be here yet.
Michelle Kane [00:49.252]-[02:13.985]: No, we're in the thick of summer. There's no doubting that. And I'm sure many of our listeners are. Hopefully you're catching Olympic fever and enjoying the games and the fun that that brings. But today we want to talk about, you know, different seasons of life, right, as we're feeling all of that. And you know for many of us many of us didn't start as solos and some of us when we're solos we dip back into the working world so we just want to talk a bit about you know how does that work if you're listening and you're thinking of of forging ahead and becoming a solo or if you've worked as a solo for a while but you know the prospect of you know, getting a job and, you know, working for a company is just a better fit for you right now. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. We just want to talk through how does that work? How might that look for you? I know for me, you know, as I've shared before, my business is a recession baby born around 2009. when one of the non-profits that was employing me went severely non-profit at the same time the economy was bleeding out jobs. So I LLC'd this thing and somehow, thankfully, I'm still here, which is really weird.
Karen Swim, APR [02:13.985]-[03:06.962]: I love that. And Yeah, I started my business around that time too. What I love today though, is that it was common many years ago to consult because we didn't even talk about solo or freelance to consult when you were in between jobs. So if you were laid off or, you know, and so it really was, it was not seen as the thing that you aspire to in your career. It was a stopgap measure and people sort of like, Oh, you're a consultant. And, and it was almost code for you, you couldn't find work or you were out of work. And so I love that we have evolved to the point where being a consultant, being a solo can be the, you know, the breadth of your career journey, or it can just be a step on your career ladder.
Michelle Kane [03:07.855]-[04:08.170]: Oh, completely, completely. And I know when I was looking into starting out, you know, you want to make sure that you check some of the boxes. I mean, maybe some of you do. Maybe some of you just want to jump in and experience it, you know, experience it full on. But I know for me, I had to ask myself some questions, right? It's like, you know, am I self-motivated enough to work alone? How do I feel about not getting that direct deposit every two weeks? Well, that was answered for me. But if that's, if that's not, you know, if you're not in that position, how does that feel? What would it take, you know, financially to meet your needs when you're thinking about owning your business of, okay, you know, taxes, all those subscriptions you would need, health insurance, all those fun things, all these things to take into account before you take that leap. depending on your personality.
Karen Swim, APR [04:08.170]-[05:09.887]: Yeah. I jumped in the deep end of the ocean. Um, and, but for me, it was, I had lost a husband, so I was widowed and starting over and I had taken time out of the workforce for a couple of years to care for him. And when I went back to work after his death, I kind of realized that I just wasn't into the whole corporate thing anymore. I saw people taking themselves far too seriously and taking titles far too seriously. And I just thought, you know what, I don't want that. So it was kind of this, it was my attitude about work was changing. It wasn't necessarily that I hated the companies that I'd worked for, I hated my job. It's just, you know, I'm like, Is this it? Because I don't want that. And I don't want to, if this is the future, I'm just not into it. I don't want to do that.
Michelle Kane [05:09.887]-[06:06.230]: Yeah, it's interesting that you say that because I think as a culture, I think many more people are arriving at that point now, you know, especially, you know, COVID sort of accelerated that. And because, let's face it, you know, because of all the opportunities we have at our disposal, thanks to the use of the internet, it is so much easier to go out on your own. So I think we have that luxury of taking a look at, ugh, Do I really want to whim in this one lane and you have to act a certain way? And like you say, jump through all these hoops. And that in and of itself is kind of exhausting on a certain level to live up to some elements of corporate culture. And it can be demoralizing in a way.
Karen Swim, APR [06:06.230]-[08:25.939]: But I also want to point out that while Solos and, you know, MBO Partners, which full disclosure is a client of mine, does this study called the State of Independence in America. And the 2024 study will be out in the fall, but it's the longest longitudinal study about freelancers, solos, and independent workers. And one of the things that they show is that control remains one of the top reasons that people leave their traditional jobs, stop being W-2 employees to become self-employed, is that they want control. And not control in a like, I am the smartest, I know everything, I don't want anybody telling me what to do, but control over the types of work that you do, control over the skills that you use, control over your growth. You know, let's face it, when you are in a corporate job, there's a lot of things that you can still do on your own. If you're interested, you can pay to develop yourselves in areas. But most of the time, we're really limited by our job descriptions and what people think that we should know. And so you don't always get the exposure to other areas of the business as you do when you are the company. and you get to play in different areas. And sometimes you discover interests and talents that you would not have discovered if you were just limited to, you can't do that because that's not your job. So if you are in public relations, maybe you have an affinity for accounting or analytics, but it's not a part of your job. So you don't get to do that. And you just get to stay in like, and in-house PR people, don't get to do everything either. Let's remember that as solos, we get to do the depth and breadth of this job because we control that. So yeah, control remains one of the number one reasons. It's not even the money. Like a lot of people think, I'm going to become, you know, start my own business because I'm going to be a millionaire. A lot of people actually do overall make less, but they're happier.
Michelle Kane [08:25.939]-[09:53.023]: Yeah, that's very true. That's very true. And yet, you know, for that same reason, and I think this, it's the, it's a combination of where you are in life, what your needs are at any given moment. You know, it may be a time where you say, Oh, but you know what, I just want to focus on one thing for one company. So I really want to go in-house again. Right? I want that assuredness. I don't want to have to deal with some of the admin tasks that I still handle, even though I might have farmed a number of them out. I like the two weeks of AK that I'm made to take, you know, it just depends, right? And so we know we've seen solos hop in and out of the workforce. And there's absolutely no shame in that game. I mean, you need to do what's best for you and what even, even more so, what lights you up? What's lighting you up right now? And that may be, maybe you miss working on a team. You know, maybe you miss that back and forth. And not to say we don't get that as solos, because we certainly do, depending on the project or the work. But there's definitely something to be said. And I think what most importantly is, just because you declare yourself a solo doesn't mean that you have to stick with that choice no matter what, just because you decided it however long ago. And, you know.
Karen Swim, APR [09:53.023]-[12:43.797]: You're 100% right. I, again, in many, many years past, once you became a solo, there was this stigma attached to you being unemployable. Like, I can't follow directions or work as part of a team. Today, those attitudes really have changed. And, but, but I would say there are some things that you should think about. If you're, so if you are in the workforce now, and you're thinking of becoming a solo, I think the biggest thing is ensuring that you understand what the market is looking for from your profession. So that's number one, because you have to have some defined skill sets that people will value and want to pay you for. And I would say the second biggest thing is ensuring that you have a financial cushion. So you can start to prepare to be solo even while you're employed by making sure that you build that cushion even more than you think that you need, because that is going to give you the flexibility to build your business in a very thoughtful, intentional way. And it'll take pressure off. If you start a business and you're under financial pressure, it does make it harder. I'm not saying it's impossible. but it's a lot of stress. And if you're someone who is going the opposite direction, where you are thinking, you know what, I'm in the season of life, where I really want to go back in house, I want a job. And it could be for whatever reason, you, the kids are leaving, you know, to go off to college, you, you know, maybe it's a family dynamic change, and you just want to work in house, you need to start to think about Where do I really wanna be? Be intentional about your networking. Start to really be that giver where you are giving and not just taking. Don't be that person that hasn't talked to somebody for 22 months and then you're calling and saying, hey, I'm thinking about going back to work. I'd love to catch up. Do you wanna catch up or do you need something from me? So be thoughtful about your networking. Be thoughtful about looking at your skillsets in a way that would be attractive to employers. It's a great time if you feel like there's something that I'm seeing in job descriptions that maybe I don't feel, I feel that's a weakness. It seems to be one of the in-demand skills. Be aware that you do not have to be a perfect match to job descriptions because the true end to a job is networking your way into that position. So, you know, start to think like a job seeker before you actually become a job seeker, because that's going to make your search a little bit easier.
Michelle Kane [12:44.911]-[13:20.596]: Yeah, that's so true. And honestly, it's going to make you a better solo along the way. Anytime you get to strengthen your skills, you know, it is a good thing. And I know we've said this before, we should always be mindful of networking, not, you know, not in as in I need this way, because not only is that unattractive, it's, you know, It's as obvious as anything, so don't be that person. But make it a point. Yeah, make it a point to touch base with a few people. If it's every week or so, and look, do I do it as much as I should?
Karen Swim, APR [13:20.596]-[15:23.785]: Probably not. I don't think any of us, because we're tired. We're burned out. We're overwhelmed. And so I am definitely not suggesting becoming a full-time networker, but to really start to set that foundation of being intentional in your networking. So that doesn't mean taking meetings with everyone, but really start to think before you are ready to make that leap back in, what would the role look like? What are the people that you want to work with? I believe that a lot of times people go back in-house because they're excited either about a particular area of work that's being done and the impact that they can make, or it's because they get to work with a certain person. You know, in the workforce, you tend to follow people, not titles. So, you know, if you have somebody that's like an inspirational, great leader who truly developed you, and that person goes somewhere else, and they tap you to come, you'll go, because you love working with that person. So really start to think about that so that you are not flailing and just applying to every open job that's out there, but really think about where you want to be, what you want to accomplish, and what are the things that, as you said, Michelle, that really lights you up? Because I still believe that we don't have to give that up in modern day times, that we can still do work that fulfills us. Whatever that work is, whatever industry you're in, I just feel that we can still be fulfilled in our work. And sometimes for some people, they make a choice to do a job that lights them up because it provides them with the income and the benefits that they need to enjoy the rest of their life. I know people like that. They're in jobs and the job itself doesn't really light them up in that way, but they like what it gives them and it fulfills them. It allows them to live a fulfilled life. That's OK. I'm here for it. I'm listening.
Michelle Kane [15:23.785]-[15:55.817]: Yeah. I love that you made that point, because it's so true. We're fortunate that we do love what we do, that we get to spend our days doing work that we enjoy. But there is totally something to be said for doing a job that's like, eh, it's all right. But it frees you up, gives you what you need to do the things that you love to pursue. I don't know, hobbies? I'm still working on that one. Someone asked me the other day if I had hobbies and I said oh I don't know there's an old joke in PR we don't have hobbies.
Karen Swim, APR [15:55.817]-[16:10.220]: Yeah isn't that sadly true. I have interests, though. I mean, you know. We have interests. We do have interests. Far too often, though, even when you're in your interests, you find a way to bring PR into it.
Michelle Kane [16:10.220]-[17:19.416]: But it's OK, because we're strangely addicted to it. But hey, I think what you were saying just a bit ago is so true no matter which way you're going to go, right? If you're going to stay a solo, if you're looking to go in-house somewhere, You know, get that W-2. I think you just have to ask yourself, what do I want right now? What's best for me right now? And know that you have the freedom to pursue that. I think that's the most beautiful thing that we can say in this particular moment in climate. So we encourage you to do that thing. And tell us, we want to hear your stories. Have you gone in-house recently? Have you made the switch to a solo? Do you have questions about experiences? We would love to take them up in a future episode, so please do visit soloprpro.com, check out the contact page, and let us know. And if you found value in this episode, which we hope you did, please share it around, let us know, hit us up with some reviews, that would help us a whole lot. And until next time, thanks for listening to That Solo Life.
Michelle Kane[00:00- 00:18].: Thank you for joining us for this episode of That Solo Life, the podcast for PR pros and marketers who work for themselves. People like me, Michelle Kane of Voice Matters, and my wonderful co-host, Karen Swim, APR of Solo PR Pro. Hi, Karen. Here we are again. How are you doing?
Karen Swim, APR [00:18.714]-[00:22.495]: Here we are. Hello, Michelle. I'm doing great. How are you?
Michelle Kane [00:22.495]-[00:32.759]: Good, good. I'm doing well, doing well. I guess it's safe to say as we're recording this, we're hitting our midsummer stride. I'm ignoring all the back to school things. It's ridiculous. Come on now. It's still hot and humid outside.
Karen Swim, APR [00:34.504]-[00:48.665]: That's true. You know what? A lot of people are going to college in a couple of weeks. And I guess maybe some of the schools start. That's so weird because it feels like we shouldn't be here yet.
Michelle Kane [00:49.252]-[02:13.985]: No, we're in the thick of summer. There's no doubting that. And I'm sure many of our listeners are. Hopefully you're catching Olympic fever and enjoying the games and the fun that that brings. But today we want to talk about, you know, different seasons of life, right, as we're feeling all of that. And you know for many of us many of us didn't start as solos and some of us when we're solos we dip back into the working world so we just want to talk a bit about you know how does that work if you're listening and you're thinking of of forging ahead and becoming a solo or if you've worked as a solo for a while but you know the prospect of you know, getting a job and, you know, working for a company is just a better fit for you right now. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. We just want to talk through how does that work? How might that look for you? I know for me, you know, as I've shared before, my business is a recession baby born around 2009. when one of the non-profits that was employing me went severely non-profit at the same time the economy was bleeding out jobs. So I LLC'd this thing and somehow, thankfully, I'm still here, which is really weird.
Karen Swim, APR [02:13.985]-[03:06.962]: I love that. And Yeah, I started my business around that time too. What I love today though, is that it was common many years ago to consult because we didn't even talk about solo or freelance to consult when you were in between jobs. So if you were laid off or, you know, and so it really was, it was not seen as the thing that you aspire to in your career. It was a stopgap measure and people sort of like, Oh, you're a consultant. And, and it was almost code for you, you couldn't find work or you were out of work. And so I love that we have evolved to the point where being a consultant, being a solo can be the, you know, the breadth of your career journey, or it can just be a step on your career ladder.
Michelle Kane [03:07.855]-[04:08.170]: Oh, completely, completely. And I know when I was looking into starting out, you know, you want to make sure that you check some of the boxes. I mean, maybe some of you do. Maybe some of you just want to jump in and experience it, you know, experience it full on. But I know for me, I had to ask myself some questions, right? It's like, you know, am I self-motivated enough to work alone? How do I feel about not getting that direct deposit every two weeks? Well, that was answered for me. But if that's, if that's not, you know, if you're not in that position, how does that feel? What would it take, you know, financially to meet your needs when you're thinking about owning your business of, okay, you know, taxes, all those subscriptions you would need, health insurance, all those fun things, all these things to take into account before you take that leap. depending on your personality.
Karen Swim, APR [04:08.170]-[05:09.887]: Yeah. I jumped in the deep end of the ocean. Um, and, but for me, it was, I had lost a husband, so I was widowed and starting over and I had taken time out of the workforce for a couple of years to care for him. And when I went back to work after his death, I kind of realized that I just wasn't into the whole corporate thing anymore. I saw people taking themselves far too seriously and taking titles far too seriously. And I just thought, you know what, I don't want that. So it was kind of this, it was my attitude about work was changing. It wasn't necessarily that I hated the companies that I'd worked for, I hated my job. It's just, you know, I'm like, Is this it? Because I don't want that. And I don't want to, if this is the future, I'm just not into it. I don't want to do that.
Michelle Kane [05:09.887]-[06:06.230]: Yeah, it's interesting that you say that because I think as a culture, I think many more people are arriving at that point now, you know, especially, you know, COVID sort of accelerated that. And because, let's face it, you know, because of all the opportunities we have at our disposal, thanks to the use of the internet, it is so much easier to go out on your own. So I think we have that luxury of taking a look at, ugh, Do I really want to whim in this one lane and you have to act a certain way? And like you say, jump through all these hoops. And that in and of itself is kind of exhausting on a certain level to live up to some elements of corporate culture. And it can be demoralizing in a way.
Karen Swim, APR [06:06.230]-[08:25.939]: But I also want to point out that while Solos and, you know, MBO Partners, which full disclosure is a client of mine, does this study called the State of Independence in America. And the 2024 study will be out in the fall, but it's the longest longitudinal study about freelancers, solos, and independent workers. And one of the things that they show is that control remains one of the top reasons that people leave their traditional jobs, stop being W-2 employees to become self-employed, is that they want control. And not control in a like, I am the smartest, I know everything, I don't want anybody telling me what to do, but control over the types of work that you do, control over the skills that you use, control over your growth. You know, let's face it, when you are in a corporate job, there's a lot of things that you can still do on your own. If you're interested, you can pay to develop yourselves in areas. But most of the time, we're really limited by our job descriptions and what people think that we should know. And so you don't always get the exposure to other areas of the business as you do when you are the company. and you get to play in different areas. And sometimes you discover interests and talents that you would not have discovered if you were just limited to, you can't do that because that's not your job. So if you are in public relations, maybe you have an affinity for accounting or analytics, but it's not a part of your job. So you don't get to do that. And you just get to stay in like, and in-house PR people, don't get to do everything either. Let's remember that as solos, we get to do the depth and breadth of this job because we control that. So yeah, control remains one of the number one reasons. It's not even the money. Like a lot of people think, I'm going to become, you know, start my own business because I'm going to be a millionaire. A lot of people actually do overall make less, but they're happier.
Michelle Kane [08:25.939]-[09:53.023]: Yeah, that's very true. That's very true. And yet, you know, for that same reason, and I think this, it's the, it's a combination of where you are in life, what your needs are at any given moment. You know, it may be a time where you say, Oh, but you know what, I just want to focus on one thing for one company. So I really want to go in-house again. Right? I want that assuredness. I don't want to have to deal with some of the admin tasks that I still handle, even though I might have farmed a number of them out. I like the two weeks of AK that I'm made to take, you know, it just depends, right? And so we know we've seen solos hop in and out of the workforce. And there's absolutely no shame in that game. I mean, you need to do what's best for you and what even, even more so, what lights you up? What's lighting you up right now? And that may be, maybe you miss working on a team. You know, maybe you miss that back and forth. And not to say we don't get that as solos, because we certainly do, depending on the project or the work. But there's definitely something to be said. And I think what most importantly is, just because you declare yourself a solo doesn't mean that you have to stick with that choice no matter what, just because you decided it however long ago. And, you know.
Karen Swim, APR [09:53.023]-[12:43.797]: You're 100% right. I, again, in many, many years past, once you became a solo, there was this stigma attached to you being unemployable. Like, I can't follow directions or work as part of a team. Today, those attitudes really have changed. And, but, but I would say there are some things that you should think about. If you're, so if you are in the workforce now, and you're thinking of becoming a solo, I think the biggest thing is ensuring that you understand what the market is looking for from your profession. So that's number one, because you have to have some defined skill sets that people will value and want to pay you for. And I would say the second biggest thing is ensuring that you have a financial cushion. So you can start to prepare to be solo even while you're employed by making sure that you build that cushion even more than you think that you need, because that is going to give you the flexibility to build your business in a very thoughtful, intentional way. And it'll take pressure off. If you start a business and you're under financial pressure, it does make it harder. I'm not saying it's impossible. but it's a lot of stress. And if you're someone who is going the opposite direction, where you are thinking, you know what, I'm in the season of life, where I really want to go back in house, I want a job. And it could be for whatever reason, you, the kids are leaving, you know, to go off to college, you, you know, maybe it's a family dynamic change, and you just want to work in house, you need to start to think about Where do I really wanna be? Be intentional about your networking. Start to really be that giver where you are giving and not just taking. Don't be that person that hasn't talked to somebody for 22 months and then you're calling and saying, hey, I'm thinking about going back to work. I'd love to catch up. Do you wanna catch up or do you need something from me? So be thoughtful about your networking. Be thoughtful about looking at your skillsets in a way that would be attractive to employers. It's a great time if you feel like there's something that I'm seeing in job descriptions that maybe I don't feel, I feel that's a weakness. It seems to be one of the in-demand skills. Be aware that you do not have to be a perfect match to job descriptions because the true end to a job is networking your way into that position. So, you know, start to think like a job seeker before you actually become a job seeker, because that's going to make your search a little bit easier.
Michelle Kane [12:44.911]-[13:20.596]: Yeah, that's so true. And honestly, it's going to make you a better solo along the way. Anytime you get to strengthen your skills, you know, it is a good thing. And I know we've said this before, we should always be mindful of networking, not, you know, not in as in I need this way, because not only is that unattractive, it's, you know, It's as obvious as anything, so don't be that person. But make it a point. Yeah, make it a point to touch base with a few people. If it's every week or so, and look, do I do it as much as I should?
Karen Swim, APR [13:20.596]-[15:23.785]: Probably not. I don't think any of us, because we're tired. We're burned out. We're overwhelmed. And so I am definitely not suggesting becoming a full-time networker, but to really start to set that foundation of being intentional in your networking. So that doesn't mean taking meetings with everyone, but really start to think before you are ready to make that leap back in, what would the role look like? What are the people that you want to work with? I believe that a lot of times people go back in-house because they're excited either about a particular area of work that's being done and the impact that they can make, or it's because they get to work with a certain person. You know, in the workforce, you tend to follow people, not titles. So, you know, if you have somebody that's like an inspirational, great leader who truly developed you, and that person goes somewhere else, and they tap you to come, you'll go, because you love working with that person. So really start to think about that so that you are not flailing and just applying to every open job that's out there, but really think about where you want to be, what you want to accomplish, and what are the things that, as you said, Michelle, that really lights you up? Because I still believe that we don't have to give that up in modern day times, that we can still do work that fulfills us. Whatever that work is, whatever industry you're in, I just feel that we can still be fulfilled in our work. And sometimes for some people, they make a choice to do a job that lights them up because it provides them with the income and the benefits that they need to enjoy the rest of their life. I know people like that. They're in jobs and the job itself doesn't really light them up in that way, but they like what it gives them and it fulfills them. It allows them to live a fulfilled life. That's OK. I'm here for it. I'm listening.
Michelle Kane [15:23.785]-[15:55.817]: Yeah. I love that you made that point, because it's so true. We're fortunate that we do love what we do, that we get to spend our days doing work that we enjoy. But there is totally something to be said for doing a job that's like, eh, it's all right. But it frees you up, gives you what you need to do the things that you love to pursue. I don't know, hobbies? I'm still working on that one. Someone asked me the other day if I had hobbies and I said oh I don't know there's an old joke in PR we don't have hobbies.
Karen Swim, APR [15:55.817]-[16:10.220]: Yeah isn't that sadly true. I have interests, though. I mean, you know. We have interests. We do have interests. Far too often, though, even when you're in your interests, you find a way to bring PR into it.
Michelle Kane [16:10.220]-[17:19.416]: But it's OK, because we're strangely addicted to it. But hey, I think what you were saying just a bit ago is so true no matter which way you're going to go, right? If you're going to stay a solo, if you're looking to go in-house somewhere, You know, get that W-2. I think you just have to ask yourself, what do I want right now? What's best for me right now? And know that you have the freedom to pursue that. I think that's the most beautiful thing that we can say in this particular moment in climate. So we encourage you to do that thing. And tell us, we want to hear your stories. Have you gone in-house recently? Have you made the switch to a solo? Do you have questions about experiences? We would love to take them up in a future episode, so please do visit soloprpro.com, check out the contact page, and let us know. And if you found value in this episode, which we hope you did, please share it around, let us know, hit us up with some reviews, that would help us a whole lot. And until next time, thanks for listening to That Solo Life.